#281: Predestined; #282: Entry


Kaye Haychold's ambitious plan

#281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby ah42 » Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:21 pm

Predestined

Entry

My head asplodey...

Looking at the timeline, if this is the Kaye pre-singularity, where are the unascended beings? If this is the Kaye after all the MinYan fun, why is the building falling apart, when the MinYan restored everything?

And all the debris from the building is in the same place as when we first met Cursor...
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby SilverFeathers » Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:21 pm

I'm trying to think of a way to describe my reaction to this in two-dimensional wordspace and not not the three-dimensional gestures that I find easier in this case (and no, none of them are rude... just... spatial, if that makes sense.)

Maybe I'm in my usual state of misunderstanding and confusion, but there's something about TSR with all it's Kays, and maybe someone said this before, but it reminds me of the Lebniz series... I'm probably wrong...
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Wizard CaT » Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:22 pm

Two? Why two? Do we get more? I needs a fix on Friday too! ^v^

Anyway, thats a good point, either it is still Pre-Singularity and it's just museums in Tryst are about as populated as earth, or… well we already know the MinYan fixed it up. Well we think so. Even if it IS the far distant future point, the building would still decay due to the Dead Zone.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Anna » Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:28 pm

Double Feature.

Does anyone want some pop corn?
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby SilverFeathers » Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:36 pm

Anna wrote:Double Feature.

Does anyone want some pop corn?


Michael Rennie was ill
The Day the Earth Stood Still
But he told us where we stand
And Flash Gordon was there
In silver underwear
Claude Rains was The Invisible Man
Then something went wrong
For Fay Wray and King Kong
They got caught in a celluloid jam
Then at a deadly pace
It Came From Outer Space
And this is how the message ran...
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Anna » Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:23 pm

The Mystery of the double edition is slolved!

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Thanks ah42 and welcome!
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Volair » Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:27 pm

I can't help but notice the homage to the Ghostbusters with those packs of theirs.

And hey look, they have to go up a lot of stairs and will probably get more tired than one usually would! :mrgreen:

Recognized it immediately as Trys, pre-PDH but post-singularity.

Of course this has me thinking.....

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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Alikat » Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:03 am

Far Post-Singularity, at least a century Pre-Cursor Reactivation.

And thanks Jenny for the additional "Establishing Shot" strip, I like bonus lagniappes.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Jennifer Diane Reitz » Mon Jul 28, 2008 2:10 am

Alikat wrote:Far Post-Singularity, at least a century Pre-Cursor Reactivation.

And thanks Jenny for the additional "Establishing Shot" strip, I like bonus lagniappes.


Originally, I simply started with the second strip. I figured that it would be cool to have especially attentive readers work out exactly where they landed by virtue of the buildings themselves, as well as the knowledge of the events of Pastel. Then I realized that might not be as easy as I imagined, since I had drawn the buildings from an unfamiliar angle, one I never used in Pastel. I needed a better clue than that. I know those buildings, but I cannot expect everyone else to know them like I do.

Then I thought it also needs an establishing shot, a landing shot, because I have always shown the Mover enter and leave, and it would seem odd to skip the arrival scene, especially when this becomes a book.

So, I quickly reshuffled the order of my strip pages (two strips per printworthy page) and added the establishing arrival panels, cobbled together, as noted, from existing art, which I then altered a bit to account for the time period (for example, the sand garden on the top deck of the museum has not formed yet, so I had to remove it, among other little changes).

Because I thought it would be really cheap-ass of me to pass off a quickly done establishing shot made from preexisting art as an entire monday comic, I added the second strip as well so that I would not feel like I was cheating anyone. Of course there will be a comic on friday as well. The establishing shot is bonus.

That is the story behind having two comics today.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Anna » Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:26 am

he he he, and if you had place only #281 today, I had to say, you'd take a day off.

But it's funny to imagine that both stories for this moments are placed in the same minute.
A classical cross-over.
(even if it isn't so)
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby draque » Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:26 am

I tend to obsess over language, and today's strip made me think of something... in a society where the natural universe tends to fix things with time... would a phrase like "falling apart" even exist? Would the <i>concept</i> even exist? In an Trys, things tend towards order, so the concept of age degrading structures or possessions would be completely alien. If anything, wouldn't disuse imply to them that an object had become "fresh" again? Obviously the situation they are in now is an exception and they're all intelligent enough to appreciate exactly what it means... but it really struck me that in many ways the scene would be much less alien to us than to them, even though it was their home universe.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby strange_person » Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:37 am

No, there's still a degree of destruction beyond which decay proceeds on it's own.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Alfador » Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:35 am

strange_person wrote:No, there's still a degree of destruction beyond which decay proceeds on it's own.


Indeed: Chip out of a cup = chip fills back in. Something shattered to miniscule fragments = fragments become sand. It all depends on where the energy gradient takes you.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Jennifer Diane Reitz » Mon Jul 28, 2008 1:16 pm

Alfador wrote:
strange_person wrote:No, there's still a degree of destruction beyond which decay proceeds on it's own.


Indeed: Chip out of a cup = chip fills back in. Something shattered to miniscule fragments = fragments become sand. It all depends on where the energy gradient takes you.


Exactly so. Tryslmaistan is not a true, or fully anentropic universe. Rather, electanic forces provide a mild anentropic effect. However, the amount of lost information that can be restored is limited, and based on the amount of information that remains. If a cup is chipped, enough of the cup remains that the lost information can be restored, but if the cup is pulverized, the threshold of information restoration has been passed, and while the grains might weakly migrate towards each other over time, if they can, the cup is lost. In all cases the effect is weak enough that it does not occur overnight, but is a very gradual process that optimally must occur in an isolated space.

Mess with a chipped cup too much, and it won't 'heal' correctly. Put it in a cupboard and leave it for a year, and it will come back just fine, if a little covered with bits of solidified shatterel to brush off. Put a pulverized cup in the same cupboard, spreading the grains evenly, and a year later there will be a little neat pile in the geometric center of the cupboard, but the cup will not come back.

In theory, if you could leave that cupboard undisturbed for tens of thousands of years, the cup would finally reform. This is what brings back the continents and structure of the cosmos after Tryslmaistan is pulverized by Stormfall. However, since the dust of the destroyed universe is churning and interacting with itself, it doesn't 'heal' properly, which is why the continental edges are ragged and broken, and the deserts lumpen and hilly.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Volair » Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:07 pm

Jennifer Diane Reitz wrote:In theory, if you could leave that cupboard undisturbed for tens of thousands of years, the cup would finally reform. This is what brings back the continents and structure of the cosmos after Tryslmaistan is pulverized by Stormfall. However, since the dust of the destroyed universe is churning and interacting with itself, it doesn't 'heal' properly, which is why the continental edges are ragged and broken, and the deserts lumpen and hilly.


This is all quite consistent with the holographic nature of both Jellese memory and Trystlmaistan in general...

I'm quite convinced that, even if the explosives had blown Chou's head to smitherenes, if enough crystaline fragments could have been gathered, she could still have been reconstructed, because each tiny fragment would have, in low resolution, the whole of her memory, and with each added fragment, more resolution would be recovered.

In your teacup, all the tratons "remember" the whole cup, in blurry detail. but a tiny shard of a cup only has a very, very faded image stored in it, an image dominated out by the images of sand all around it...

So instead of forging into the soft, blurry image of the cup, the chip forges into the much sharper images of sand all around it. So both processes are the same: veil energy forcing groups of tratons into the shape determined by their most sharply-defined holographic memory.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Kinokochan » Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:51 pm

What I don't understand is how the native life manages to reform after the stormfall. I mean, if something as simple as a world plate has imperfections in it, wouldn't something as complex as say, a basilisk, have some major defects in it? Perhaps I'm just confused about the process.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby strange_person » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:45 pm

Ah, but living creatures have their own self-correction mechanisms. Sure, first-gen scizzortigers and basilisks and such will be lumpy, maybe even hideously deformed (by white-life standards), but the offspring will be mostly normal.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby EvilMidnightLurker » Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:06 pm

Jennifer Diane Reitz wrote:In theory, if you could leave that cupboard undisturbed for tens of thousands of years, the cup would finally reform. This is what brings back the continents and structure of the cosmos after Tryslmaistan is pulverized by Stormfall. However, since the dust of the destroyed universe is churning and interacting with itself, it doesn't 'heal' properly, which is why the continental edges are ragged and broken, and the deserts lumpen and hilly.
That brings up something I've been meaning to ask about. If the rain is an eternal phenomenon that's always been part of an eternal Tryslmaistan without beginning or end, then technically there has never been any such thing as a Trys that didn't coalesce out of Stormfall. Does it even mean anything to talk about a "proper" Trys? Would the central seas exist at all in the absence of the storm (I recall Cho saying that the depressions were due to imperfect worldplate reassembly)?
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Jennifer Diane Reitz » Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:51 am

EvilMidnightLurker wrote:
Jennifer Diane Reitz wrote:In theory, if you could leave that cupboard undisturbed for tens of thousands of years, the cup would finally reform. This is what brings back the continents and structure of the cosmos after Tryslmaistan is pulverized by Stormfall. However, since the dust of the destroyed universe is churning and interacting with itself, it doesn't 'heal' properly, which is why the continental edges are ragged and broken, and the deserts lumpen and hilly.
That brings up something I've been meaning to ask about. If the rain is an eternal phenomenon that's always been part of an eternal Tryslmaistan without beginning or end, then technically there has never been any such thing as a Trys that didn't coalesce out of Stormfall. Does it even mean anything to talk about a "proper" Trys? Would the central seas exist at all in the absence of the storm (I recall Cho saying that the depressions were due to imperfect worldplate reassembly)?


This ties directly into the whole issue of what makes Tryslmaistan so interesting to species like the hyper-advanced, multidimensional Krawlni.

Tryslmaistan, as I have written before, is a universe that 'as is ever was', which is to say it has no beginning and no ending. This is not reasonable with regard to how universes are believed (by the Krawlni and others) to exist; they bloom, or bud, out of other universes, expanding into the 'Fertile Void'. In a sense, it is turtles all the way down, if turtles were pre-existing universes.

One explanation the Krawlni favor is that there is a realm outside of the Multiverse, a place of hyper-hyper time and hyper-hyper space, incomprehensible and beyond understanding. From that superior plane, the birth and death of entire multiverses would be seen, and there would be explanation for anomalous 'line' universes like Tryslmaistan, that have no beginning and no end, and thus no parents.

The notion is that there were once (in some hyper-hyper time sense) parents to Tryslmaistan, an original parent universe from which it budded off, but that universe was erased, destroyed, eliminated such that it never existed, leaving the substance of Tryslmaistan rippling back in time to generate a past for itself as a form of ontological survival. By studying this, the Krawlni hope to gain insight into this imagined supernal realm above the level of the multiverse itself. This was what brought the Krawlni to crash into Tryslmaistan... it flew too close to the candle, as it were.

If such a supernal realm does exist, if the Krawlni are right, then there would have been not only a beginning to the universe of Tryslmaistan, but also an original state of grace for that universe where the memories of a perfect Tryslmaistan locked in the genetic structure of the Jellese would be vindicated. Those memories are possibly crumbs and bits left over from whatever extramultiversal cataclysm might have erased the parent universe of Tryslmaistan. Of course, this is all just Krawlni theory, and even they have no proof of it. Yet.

But if it were true, then perhaps there was a 'hyper-hyper time' where Tryslmaistan was perfect, and where there was no multiversal rain passing through it. Perhaps the multiversal rainstorm is the wake, the churn, the ripples left by the parent-destroying cataclysm... or, more likely, the multiversal rain is just a natural weather of the multiverse, which intersected Tryslmaistan after that same cataclysm.

The Krawlni consider such research of import for obvious reasons; if there is a supernal realm in which multiverses float just as universes sit within a multiverse, and that realm has its own phenomena, its own weather, which is capable of excising entire branches of the tree of causality in the multiverse... then every universe is potentially at risk. Not just at risk of being destroyed or affected, but at risk of having never existed at all, a state from which the Krawlni can currently see no possible rescue or solution.

So the big question is whether or not there ever was a 'perfect' Tryslmaistan, and if there was, how that could be, and what that means on larger scales than the... largest scale. These are the questions creatures like the Krawlni ponder... what the beginning of a universe without any beginning would actually mean, or be.

If they ever find out for sure, I will pass it on.
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Re: #281: Predestined; #282: Entry

Postby Alikat » Sun Aug 03, 2008 1:54 am

"Perfect Trys" is a gem on a pendant worn by a hyper-hyper being, and when she dropped her pendant into the Fertile Void it grew layers of reality like a pearl grows from an irritating bit of sand. Somewhere in one of the primordial splays of Trys there is a perfectly tetrahedral gem laying buried in the sand. Inside the gem is a perfectly clockwork Trys, complete with orderly Whitelife operating like a fancy German Town Square clock.
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